In this episode of StallSide Kentucky Derby and Belmont Stakes winning trainer of Golden Tempo, Cherie DeVaux, shares her insights into selecting young horses, developing their potential, and preparing them for success on the racetrack. She also discusses her unwavering commitment to horse welfare, emphasizing thoughtful training, individualized care, and always putting the horse first. Hear how her philosophy of horsemanship shapes every decision, from the barn to the winner's circle. #GoldenTempo #CherieDeVaux
#GoldenTempo #CherieDeVaux
00:00:00.200 - 00:00:04.160
Today's episode of the Stall Side Podcast was brought to you by Rood and Riddle Veterinary Pharmacy.
00:00:04.160 - 00:00:04.490
Bart,
00:00:04.490 - 00:00:05.759
how are you doing today?
00:00:05.759 - 00:00:06.160
I'm great,
00:00:06.160 - 00:00:06.400
Peter.
00:00:06.400 - 00:00:06.879
How are you?
00:00:06.879 - 00:00:07.440
I'm really good,
00:00:07.440 - 00:00:07.759
thanks.
00:00:07.759 - 00:00:09.720
I'm very excited about the next guest.
00:00:09.720 - 00:00:09.939
Ah,
00:00:09.939 - 00:00:10.570
me as well.
00:00:10.570 - 00:00:12.640
So we have Kentucky Derby winning trainer,
00:00:12.640 - 00:00:13.619
Cherie Deveaux,
00:00:13.619 - 00:00:16.079
has agreed to be on the show with us today.
00:00:16.079 - 00:00:16.719
Yeah,
00:00:16.719 - 00:00:19.719
this is somebody that really has a good eye for a horse,
00:00:19.719 - 00:00:22.280
and she's a very entertaining speaker.
00:00:22.280 - 00:00:22.750
I mean,
00:00:22.750 - 00:00:26.129
her insights into a horse and what makes it an elite athlete,
00:00:26.129 - 00:00:29.089
I'm very much looking forward to her telling us that.
00:00:29.089 - 00:00:29.940
Absolutely.
00:00:29.940 - 00:00:31.289
She did such a great job,
00:00:31.289 - 00:00:32.640
not just with the horse,
00:00:32.640 - 00:00:36.340
but how she handled things in the post-game interviews,
00:00:36.340 - 00:00:37.229
and I just,
00:00:37.229 - 00:00:38.159
I'm a fan.
00:00:38.159 - 00:00:38.649
Yeah,
00:00:38.649 - 00:00:40.990
she's a fantastic ambassador for the sport,
00:00:40.990 - 00:00:45.679
and hopefully she's going to demystify the science of training a little bit for us today.
00:00:45.679 - 00:00:45.950
Yeah,
00:00:45.950 - 00:00:47.530
looking forward to having her in here.
00:00:47.530 - 00:00:48.560
So let's get on with it.
00:00:48.560 - 00:00:48.799
Yeah,
00:00:48.799 - 00:00:50.500
and so on Stall Side this week,
00:00:50.500 - 00:00:51.549
we have Cherie Deveaux,
00:00:51.549 - 00:00:53.079
Kentucky Derby winning trainer.
00:00:53.079 - 00:00:59.320
She's going to tell us all about what she sees in a horse and what makes an athlete an athlete.
00:01:03.750 - 00:01:04.079
Mr.
00:01:04.079 - 00:01:04.469
Bowe,
00:01:04.469 - 00:01:06.039
welcome to Stoolside.
00:01:06.040 - 00:01:07.600
Thanks for having me on.
00:01:07.599 - 00:01:07.750
Yeah,
00:01:07.750 - 00:01:09.750
thank you so much for taking the time to be with us.
00:01:09.750 - 00:01:13.310
I know you're very busy and for you to take a break and be with us means a lot.
00:01:13.310 - 00:01:13.650
Well,
00:01:13.650 - 00:01:14.520
I had to get Dr.
00:01:14.519 - 00:01:16.060
Morrissey out to look at something,
00:01:16.060 - 00:01:17.510
so this was the compromise we had.
00:01:17.510 - 00:01:19.560
He took time out of his schedule,
00:01:19.560 - 00:01:20.670
so I have to take time out of mine.
00:01:20.670 - 00:01:21.060
Okay,
00:01:21.060 - 00:01:22.180
well I hope he was,
00:01:22.180 - 00:01:22.670
you know,
00:01:22.670 - 00:01:26.260
used the eraser instead of the sharp end of the pencil when he was writing your bill.
00:01:26.260 - 00:01:26.790
That's good.
00:01:26.789 - 00:01:27.699
Absolutely.
00:01:27.700 - 00:01:28.189
Cherie,
00:01:28.189 - 00:01:31.939
tell us a little bit about yourself.
00:01:31.939 - 00:01:32.519
So,
00:01:32.519 - 00:01:37.069
I am most recently known as the trainer of Golden Tempo,
00:01:37.069 - 00:01:40.590
who has won the 152nd Kentucky Derby and,
00:01:40.590 - 00:01:41.670
most recently,
00:01:41.670 - 00:01:42.950
the Belmont Stakes.
00:01:42.950 - 00:01:43.250
So,
00:01:43.250 - 00:01:46.270
I've been training on my own for eight years.
00:01:46.270 - 00:01:50.780
I started in a standard-bred family.
00:01:50.780 - 00:01:53.229
They took a sabbatical.
00:01:53.229 - 00:01:55.349
I got into rodeo.
00:01:55.349 - 00:01:57.039
I used to barrel race.
00:01:57.039 - 00:01:57.899
And then,
00:01:57.900 - 00:01:58.950
from there,
00:01:58.950 - 00:02:03.319
my parents unceremoniously...
00:02:03.319 - 00:02:04.669
they moved to Florida.
00:02:04.670 - 00:02:06.370
They got out of the business.
00:02:06.370 - 00:02:06.939
Like I said,
00:02:06.939 - 00:02:07.989
they took a sabbatical.
00:02:07.989 - 00:02:10.269
And they wanted to move back.
00:02:10.269 - 00:02:11.069
And I said,
00:02:11.069 - 00:02:12.949
"I'm going to stay". So,
00:02:12.949 - 00:02:15.549
they waited until I was finished with high school,
00:02:15.550 - 00:02:16.600
dropped me off at college,
00:02:16.599 - 00:02:17.629
and left up to New York.
00:02:17.629 - 00:02:18.329
So,
00:02:18.329 - 00:02:20.529
that first year,
00:02:20.530 - 00:02:28.090
I was getting a lot of scholarships and financial aid for being an in-state student.
00:02:28.090 - 00:02:29.550
And when they left,
00:02:29.550 - 00:02:31.110
they took that away.
00:02:31.110 - 00:02:31.260
So,
00:02:31.259 - 00:02:32.389
I got two years.
00:02:32.389 - 00:02:33.259
And then,
00:02:33.259 - 00:02:36.029
I moved to New York to continue.
00:02:36.030 - 00:02:37.189
I was pre-med.
00:02:37.189 - 00:02:40.099
I went to school to be a physical therapist.
00:02:40.099 - 00:02:45.500
I just wanted a life that I could afford horses and not have to worry about it.
00:02:45.500 - 00:02:49.099
And when I went to New York that summer,
00:02:49.099 - 00:02:51.560
so from 2000-2002,
00:02:51.560 - 00:02:53.670
I was at Florida Gulf Coast University.
00:02:53.670 - 00:02:55.150
And then,
00:02:55.150 - 00:02:59.689
when I moved in the summer of 2002,
00:02:59.689 - 00:03:00.959
I needed a job.
00:03:00.959 - 00:03:02.709
And I got a job hot-walking.
00:03:02.709 - 00:03:05.509
And that's how I was introduced to thoroughbreds.
00:03:05.509 - 00:03:06.149
I thought,
00:03:06.150 - 00:03:06.620
"Okay,
00:03:06.620 - 00:03:07.000
well,
00:03:07.000 - 00:03:09.110
I can ride these horses". And so,
00:03:09.110 - 00:03:11.210
I did two years at SUNY Albany,
00:03:11.209 - 00:03:14.389
and lost a full year of credits transferring states.
00:03:14.389 - 00:03:14.819
Which,
00:03:14.819 - 00:03:17.439
I wasn't really that interested in that anymore.
00:03:17.439 - 00:03:19.389
I wanted to just go and ride.
00:03:19.389 - 00:03:21.110
And broke my leg.
00:03:21.110 - 00:03:23.319
And then that...
00:03:23.319 - 00:03:24.870
I had a really bad break.
00:03:24.870 - 00:03:28.759
And my galloping career was gonna be short-lived.
00:03:28.759 - 00:03:29.020
So,
00:03:29.020 - 00:03:31.250
I worked for Chuck Simon at the time.
00:03:31.250 - 00:03:33.539
And he took me under his wing.
00:03:33.539 - 00:03:35.319
I was kind of...
00:03:35.319 - 00:03:36.479
love to party,
00:03:36.479 - 00:03:37.830
love to go out.
00:03:37.830 - 00:03:39.289
No sense of direction.
00:03:39.289 - 00:03:42.030
Which was the first time in my life I ever had that.
00:03:42.030 - 00:03:42.400
So,
00:03:42.400 - 00:03:44.229
he kind of put the blinkers on and said,
00:03:44.229 - 00:03:47.879
"I want to teach you how to be an assistant trainer". And it all ties back.
00:03:47.879 - 00:03:52.199
Because Chuck's first job was for my father at the harness track.
00:03:52.199 - 00:03:52.509
So,
00:03:52.509 - 00:03:54.550
he kind of gave me directions.
00:03:54.550 - 00:03:56.430
I worked for him for six years.
00:03:56.430 - 00:03:59.240
And then I worked for Chad Brown.
00:03:59.240 - 00:04:01.830
And he was up-and-coming at the time.
00:04:01.830 - 00:04:02.229
He was...
00:04:02.229 - 00:04:03.310
he was very well known.
00:04:03.310 - 00:04:05.389
Just not the Chad Brown that is now.
00:04:05.389 - 00:04:07.939
But I got to be part of that on his team.
00:04:07.939 - 00:04:10.099
I was his assistant trainer.
00:04:10.099 - 00:04:11.639
One of the main assistant trainers.
00:04:11.639 - 00:04:12.469
So,
00:04:12.469 - 00:04:14.930
I got a lot of experience in that job.
00:04:14.930 - 00:04:17.460
And exposed to a lot of wonderful horses.
00:04:17.460 - 00:04:22.550
And then went out on my own when I met my husband David in 2018.
00:04:22.550 - 00:04:23.000
Okay,
00:04:23.000 - 00:04:24.100
that's fabulous.
00:04:24.100 - 00:04:24.350
So,
00:04:24.350 - 00:04:25.120
you mentioned,
00:04:25.120 - 00:04:25.629
you know,
00:04:25.629 - 00:04:26.430
a couple trainers.
00:04:26.430 - 00:04:31.899
Are there any other inspiration role models in your life that you've you've looked up to?
00:04:31.899 - 00:04:32.949
You know,
00:04:32.949 - 00:04:35.029
Chuck was my mentor.
00:04:35.029 - 00:04:41.610
I take a little bit from anybody that I come across on the racetrack.
00:04:41.610 - 00:04:44.259
I think that as a trainer or as,
00:04:44.259 - 00:04:45.340
you know,
00:04:45.340 - 00:04:46.800
any aspect of what we do,
00:04:46.800 - 00:04:49.669
you always have to be open to learning new things.
00:04:49.669 - 00:04:52.509
Or paying attention to what others do.
00:04:52.509 - 00:04:52.649
So,
00:04:52.649 - 00:04:53.120
you know,
00:04:53.120 - 00:04:56.470
I kind of take what I can from every experience that I'm exposed to.
00:04:56.470 - 00:04:56.830
Yeah,
00:04:56.830 - 00:04:59.790
and you mentioned trainer and assistant trainer.
00:04:59.789 - 00:05:01.959
For people that listen,
00:05:01.960 - 00:05:04.759
what's the difference between an assistant trainer and a trainer?
00:05:04.759 - 00:05:05.189
And how do you,
00:05:05.189 - 00:05:05.460
sort of,
00:05:05.460 - 00:05:07.200
migrate from one to the next?
00:05:07.199 - 00:05:09.569
So when you're at a large stable,
00:05:09.569 - 00:05:10.949
like when I worked for Chad,
00:05:10.949 - 00:05:15.990
you're basically the trainer assisting the trainer.
00:05:15.990 - 00:05:20.019
So I would run the barn as if Chad was there,
00:05:20.019 - 00:05:22.860
and I'm the liaison from the barn to him.
00:05:22.860 - 00:05:25.600
And then I feed him all the information,
00:05:25.600 - 00:05:26.600
and he takes that.
00:05:26.600 - 00:05:29.129
And he would disseminate what I would say,
00:05:29.129 - 00:05:30.149
and got really good.
00:05:30.149 - 00:05:31.310
I didn't have to say much,
00:05:31.310 - 00:05:31.959
but he'd say,
00:05:31.959 - 00:05:36.269
"I know you really like that horse". So you're basically the trainer,
00:05:36.269 - 00:05:39.860
and the trainer runs the entire business.
00:05:39.860 - 00:05:40.079
So,
00:05:40.079 - 00:05:40.639
you know,
00:05:40.639 - 00:05:42.019
that would be like the CEO,
00:05:42.019 - 00:05:42.560
and then,
00:05:42.560 - 00:05:43.189
you know,
00:05:43.189 - 00:05:44.240
go on down.
00:05:44.240 - 00:05:45.970
So that's how it works,
00:05:45.970 - 00:05:47.709
kind of how it works in my barn.
00:05:47.709 - 00:05:50.620
I have each barn set up with an assistant trainer,
00:05:50.620 - 00:05:54.180
and what we do every morning is we go over all the horses,
00:05:54.180 - 00:05:57.430
and I talk about all the horses almost every day.
00:05:57.430 - 00:05:59.759
But the assistant trainers are the unsung heroes.
00:05:59.759 - 00:06:01.029
I know there's a lot of jobs,
00:06:01.029 - 00:06:02.379
and everyone's important,
00:06:02.379 - 00:06:05.199
but the assistant trainers are usually there with the grooms,
00:06:05.199 - 00:06:06.600
about 4-4.30,
00:06:06.600 - 00:06:08.310
and they're the last to leave.
00:06:08.310 - 00:06:11.230
And they keep the barn running,
00:06:11.230 - 00:06:13.500
they check all the horses,
00:06:13.500 - 00:06:15.550
they are there for the blacksmith,
00:06:15.550 - 00:06:16.370
and the vets,
00:06:16.370 - 00:06:17.540
and everybody.
00:06:17.540 - 00:06:18.860
So they are really,
00:06:18.860 - 00:06:19.540
you know,
00:06:19.540 - 00:06:21.170
every job is important,
00:06:21.170 - 00:06:22.810
but their job is really,
00:06:22.810 - 00:06:24.389
really important.
00:06:24.389 - 00:06:24.709
Yeah.
00:06:24.709 - 00:06:26.370
So what's the...
00:06:26.370 - 00:06:27.829
training a horse.
00:06:27.829 - 00:06:29.699
It sort of sounds like it's something that,
00:06:29.699 - 00:06:29.980
"Oh,
00:06:29.980 - 00:06:32.879
you just train a horse". But what goes into training that horse,
00:06:32.879 - 00:06:36.680
and what do you see in that horse that sort of makes you think,
00:06:36.680 - 00:06:37.110
"Hey,
00:06:37.110 - 00:06:38.600
this horse has potential.
00:06:38.600 - 00:06:39.750
I think I need to do X,
00:06:39.750 - 00:06:39.939
Y,
00:06:39.939 - 00:06:46.110
and Z to actually make this horse into what it's going to be". So they're like athletes.
00:06:46.110 - 00:06:47.170
They come in,
00:06:47.170 - 00:06:50.980
and most of my horses come in to me as two-year-olds.
00:06:50.980 - 00:06:53.589
And we've scouted them from sales,
00:06:53.589 - 00:06:55.610
either weanling sales,
00:06:55.610 - 00:06:56.670
yearling sales,
00:06:56.670 - 00:06:58.339
two-year-old training sales.
00:06:58.339 - 00:06:59.759
And like Golden Tempo,
00:06:59.759 - 00:07:01.269
we do have homebreds.
00:07:01.269 - 00:07:03.310
But they get their pre-training,
00:07:03.310 - 00:07:06.870
and we start to get notes on them early on.
00:07:06.870 - 00:07:07.230
You know,
00:07:07.230 - 00:07:08.110
this one's precocious,
00:07:08.110 - 00:07:12.139
this one is a little bit busy mentally.
00:07:12.139 - 00:07:13.170
You know,
00:07:13.170 - 00:07:20.949
so each step we're trying to monitor both their physical attributes and their mental attributes.
00:07:20.949 - 00:07:23.149
So when they come in to me,
00:07:23.149 - 00:07:24.490
they're like,
00:07:24.490 - 00:07:25.300
I'd say,
00:07:25.300 - 00:07:27.629
junior high kids.
00:07:27.629 - 00:07:30.959
And the colts are all walking around on their hind legs,
00:07:30.959 - 00:07:32.310
and the fillies are straightforward,
00:07:32.310 - 00:07:34.939
then it switches when the fillies get fit.
00:07:34.939 - 00:07:37.920
They're wanting to be bad and temperamental,
00:07:37.920 - 00:07:41.649
and then the colts are the ones that kind of like shake it off.
00:07:41.649 - 00:07:44.220
So it's kind of same as high school.
00:07:44.220 - 00:07:44.810
But,
00:07:44.810 - 00:07:45.360
you know,
00:07:45.360 - 00:07:46.600
they are athletes,
00:07:46.600 - 00:07:49.319
and what we're doing is we're molding them.
00:07:49.319 - 00:07:51.899
So most of their two-year-old year,
00:07:51.899 - 00:07:54.750
we're watching them every day.
00:07:54.750 - 00:07:57.069
We try to stay on top of them,
00:07:57.069 - 00:07:58.439
watch every aspect.
00:07:58.439 - 00:08:00.519
How their legs look first thing in the morning.
00:08:00.519 - 00:08:01.920
And we do this for all the horses.
00:08:01.920 - 00:08:03.470
How they jog up prior to galloping.
00:08:03.470 - 00:08:05.329
Are they comfortable on the track?
00:08:05.329 - 00:08:08.560
Are they getting too far ahead of themselves mentally?
00:08:08.560 - 00:08:11.149
Do we have to rein them back before we push them forward?
00:08:11.149 - 00:08:11.389
So,
00:08:11.389 - 00:08:12.050
you know,
00:08:12.050 - 00:08:13.110
it's a lot of nuances,
00:08:13.110 - 00:08:14.639
and it's a lot of development.
00:08:14.639 - 00:08:16.670
It's a lot of keeping your finger to the pulse.
00:08:16.670 - 00:08:17.810
And,
00:08:17.810 - 00:08:18.810
you know,
00:08:18.810 - 00:08:21.410
so you'll start to see some horses come out,
00:08:21.410 - 00:08:24.480
and from day one they stamp themselves as a good horse.
00:08:24.480 - 00:08:26.509
They're serious about their business.
00:08:26.550 - 00:08:28.050
you know,
00:08:28.050 - 00:08:30.600
a lot of horses have ailments and setbacks,
00:08:30.600 - 00:08:32.440
but they don't make that as an excuse.
00:08:32.440 - 00:08:32.890
You know,
00:08:32.889 - 00:08:34.339
they'll have a little something,
00:08:34.339 - 00:08:35.809
they'll kind of work through it,
00:08:35.809 - 00:08:40.399
but they don't really use it as an excuse to not do what they're supposed to do.
00:08:40.399 - 00:08:41.129
And those,
00:08:41.129 - 00:08:43.910
those horses that are kind of at the top,
00:08:43.910 - 00:08:49.430
the top horses usually will stand out early on.
00:08:49.430 - 00:08:50.880
And then it becomes,
00:08:50.879 - 00:08:51.620
you know,
00:08:51.620 - 00:08:53.309
how each horse,
00:08:53.309 - 00:08:57.149
how can we develop them to be the best of their ability?
00:08:57.149 - 00:08:59.759
So not every horse is going to be a stakes horse,
00:08:59.759 - 00:09:02.149
but if a horse is not going to be a stakes horse,
00:09:02.149 - 00:09:05.509
how do I make this horse fulfill,
00:09:05.509 - 00:09:08.139
how do we make him be the,
00:09:08.139 - 00:09:09.230
he or she,
00:09:09.230 - 00:09:14.250
how do we make them be the best athlete and get the most out of them in a responsible manner?
00:09:14.250 - 00:09:14.529
So,
00:09:14.529 - 00:09:15.180
you know,
00:09:15.180 - 00:09:16.029
that's when,
00:09:16.029 - 00:09:16.740
you know,
00:09:16.740 - 00:09:19.350
we're starting to race them or we're starting to,
00:09:19.350 - 00:09:20.000
you know,
00:09:20.000 - 00:09:22.629
that you don't want to peg one to the other.
00:09:22.629 - 00:09:28.769
Sometimes you just see them and they're just going through the motions and they're a little aloof and then they have the light bulb moment and then they're,
00:09:28.769 - 00:09:29.309
they go on.
00:09:29.309 - 00:09:33.169
But you can usually tell if they're just not putting it all out there in the race before they,
00:09:33.170 - 00:09:33.660
you know,
00:09:33.660 - 00:09:35.779
they are usually like that in the morning.
00:09:35.779 - 00:09:40.870
They're kind of just like going through the motions and they breeze fine but they're not like,
00:09:40.870 - 00:09:41.970
you know,
00:09:41.970 - 00:09:44.190
catching your eye.
00:09:44.190 - 00:09:47.870
But I do laugh because Barry Eisman,
00:09:47.870 - 00:09:49.840
who breaks a majority of our horses,
00:09:49.840 - 00:09:55.830
he was the one that said Golden Tempo was so slow you could put him with the plow horse.
00:09:56.500 - 00:09:57.500
That's awesome.
00:09:57.500 - 00:10:02.500
So it sounds like you kind of need to get to know your horses,
00:10:02.500 - 00:10:05.649
and there's not a recipe in the barn for a trainer,
00:10:05.649 - 00:10:09.039
but every horse is kind of individualized,
00:10:09.039 - 00:10:12.099
and you got to get to know the horses to get the most out of them.
00:10:12.100 - 00:10:14.029
And that's my approach to it.
00:10:14.029 - 00:10:15.779
Some are different,
00:10:15.779 - 00:10:17.689
some are just march on,
00:10:17.690 - 00:10:20.020
and when they're stopped,
00:10:20.019 - 00:10:20.799
say stop.
00:10:20.799 - 00:10:25.449
But we really try to individualize the training of each of them,
00:10:25.450 - 00:10:26.080
you know,
00:10:26.080 - 00:10:28.150
because they're not all the same,
00:10:28.149 - 00:10:28.789
you know,
00:10:28.789 - 00:10:30.259
physically or mentally.
00:10:30.259 - 00:10:30.819
And so,
00:10:30.820 - 00:10:34.340
when you talk about the mental capacity of a horse,
00:10:34.340 - 00:10:37.700
that sounds like it's just as important as the physical part of a horse.
00:10:37.700 - 00:10:39.420
How do you gauge that if you have some,
00:10:39.419 - 00:10:40.579
if you're helping,
00:10:40.580 - 00:10:42.660
if you're consulting with somebody buying horses?
00:10:42.659 - 00:10:50.419
Does that play into how a horse acts at the sales or what their parents were like or anything like that?
00:10:50.419 - 00:10:50.909
Yeah,
00:10:50.909 - 00:10:52.100
most definitely.
00:10:52.100 - 00:10:52.740
We watch,
00:10:52.740 - 00:10:54.659
when I'm looking at a horse,
00:10:54.659 - 00:10:59.829
we get a very small snapshot at the sale because there's so many that we're looking at.
00:10:59.830 - 00:11:01.070
But I try to make a point to,
00:11:01.069 - 00:11:01.389
like,
00:11:01.389 - 00:11:02.700
just pet each horse.
00:11:02.700 - 00:11:05.490
And you kind of just have this really brief interaction.
00:11:05.490 - 00:11:08.029
I've had some just come right at you and they're,
00:11:08.029 - 00:11:08.470
like,
00:11:08.470 - 00:11:09.100
not nice.
00:11:09.100 - 00:11:11.509
And then you have some that are just flaky,
00:11:11.509 - 00:11:12.309
you know.
00:11:12.309 - 00:11:12.949
Some are scared,
00:11:12.950 - 00:11:13.300
but,
00:11:13.299 - 00:11:13.589
you know,
00:11:13.590 - 00:11:14.670
you give them a chance and,
00:11:14.669 - 00:11:15.120
you know,
00:11:15.120 - 00:11:16.659
you could just see that it's not there.
00:11:16.659 - 00:11:18.909
And then you watch them in the back ring.
00:11:18.909 - 00:11:22.839
And if they can handle all that they've been through prior to the sale,
00:11:22.840 - 00:11:26.500
going up in the back ring and can maintain their composure,
00:11:26.500 - 00:11:28.740
then you're probably in good shape.
00:11:28.740 - 00:11:31.700
Because on the big days and what you're looking for,
00:11:31.700 - 00:11:34.269
they have to be able to handle all of that.
00:11:34.269 - 00:11:35.720
And I'm just...
00:11:35.720 - 00:11:38.180
Golden Tempo is my big horse right now.
00:11:38.180 - 00:11:39.470
But that horse,
00:11:39.470 - 00:11:40.730
when I said...
00:11:40.730 - 00:11:42.850
When I felt he was a really good horse,
00:11:42.850 - 00:11:44.750
he was a horse that was kind of always...
00:11:44.750 - 00:11:45.549
Not a wow horse,
00:11:45.549 - 00:11:46.519
but you could see.
00:11:46.519 - 00:11:47.329
Always coming,
00:11:47.330 - 00:11:49.230
always doing what he was supposed to do.
00:11:49.230 - 00:11:49.889
But one day,
00:11:49.889 - 00:11:51.120
we're in New Orleans,
00:11:51.120 - 00:11:52.419
and the horse...
00:11:52.419 - 00:11:53.620
It's a small track,
00:11:53.620 - 00:11:54.909
and it gets really busy,
00:11:54.909 - 00:11:56.870
and horses are flying around.
00:11:56.870 - 00:11:58.730
And it was a really crisp day,
00:11:58.730 - 00:12:00.340
and the wind's going.
00:12:00.340 - 00:12:01.230
And he stood there,
00:12:01.230 - 00:12:02.460
and horses are flying at him.
00:12:02.460 - 00:12:02.970
And he just,
00:12:02.970 - 00:12:03.250
like,
00:12:03.250 - 00:12:03.899
put his ears up,
00:12:03.899 - 00:12:05.389
and he just took it all in.
00:12:05.389 - 00:12:07.889
And that's when you know you have a really good horse.
00:12:07.889 - 00:12:08.319
You know,
00:12:08.319 - 00:12:10.799
they've got to have the talent to match it.
00:12:10.799 - 00:12:12.539
But that personality,
00:12:12.539 - 00:12:14.019
you can't teach them.
00:12:14.019 - 00:12:14.789
Yeah.
00:12:14.789 - 00:12:15.099
Yeah.
00:12:15.100 - 00:12:17.500
So you think these horses like to run?
00:12:17.500 - 00:12:18.399
They do.
00:12:18.399 - 00:12:24.339
And I think that's something that is of great discussion and debate.
00:12:24.340 - 00:12:27.629
But I can tell you that if a horse isn't going to...
00:12:27.629 - 00:12:28.960
Doesn't want to do it,
00:12:28.960 - 00:12:30.180
they don't do it.
00:12:30.180 - 00:12:31.900
And it's not...
00:12:31.899 - 00:12:34.620
Some horses just aren't talented,
00:12:34.620 - 00:12:36.259
and they're slow.
00:12:36.259 - 00:12:36.529
And...
00:12:36.529 - 00:12:38.610
But they will still continue to go out there.
00:12:38.610 - 00:12:39.840
And they'll still try.
00:12:39.840 - 00:12:41.620
But if a horse doesn't want to do it,
00:12:41.620 - 00:12:43.370
they're just not going to do it.
00:12:43.370 - 00:12:44.580
And we don't...
00:12:44.580 - 00:12:45.539
In my training,
00:12:45.539 - 00:12:47.620
every time a horse breezes,
00:12:47.620 - 00:12:51.129
we're letting them do what's well within themselves.
00:12:51.129 - 00:12:52.819
We don't make them go faster.
00:12:52.819 - 00:12:53.289
You know,
00:12:53.289 - 00:12:54.220
we'll just...
00:12:54.220 - 00:12:54.840
Some of them,
00:12:54.840 - 00:12:55.800
you coax them along.
00:12:55.799 - 00:12:59.059
But we're not out there asking them for life and death.
00:12:59.059 - 00:13:00.129
And they're not giving it to us.
00:13:00.129 - 00:13:01.519
We're going to keep asking them.
00:13:01.519 - 00:13:06.879
So everything that I'd say 90% when we're getting a horse ready for a race,
00:13:06.879 - 00:13:08.819
they're doing on their own.
00:13:08.819 - 00:13:09.169
Yeah,
00:13:09.169 - 00:13:12.189
and I think that's something for people to realize as well,
00:13:12.190 - 00:13:14.720
is that the horse is actually part of this equation.
00:13:14.720 - 00:13:17.620
It's not like we're impressing our will upon this horse and saying,
00:13:17.620 - 00:13:19.700
"You will do this". The horse has to say,
00:13:19.700 - 00:13:20.050
"Okay,
00:13:20.049 - 00:13:22.179
you've shown me what's possible here.
00:13:22.180 - 00:13:26.440
Why don't I go and meet that?" So when you're trying to coax something out of a horse,
00:13:26.440 - 00:13:29.210
say some of them are just mentally not quite there,
00:13:29.210 - 00:13:31.240
how do you adjust your training?
00:13:31.240 - 00:13:33.519
Do you give them a little bit more to do?
00:13:33.519 - 00:13:34.829
Do you give them less to do?
00:13:34.830 - 00:13:36.700
What part does nutrition play in that?
00:13:36.700 - 00:13:42.570
How do you actually bring that potential out when the horse may not realize it itself until it has that light bulb moment?
00:13:42.569 - 00:13:45.309
Sometimes you just have a light bulb moment.
00:13:45.309 - 00:13:46.019
You know,
00:13:46.019 - 00:13:48.549
some of it just comes with maturity.
00:13:48.549 - 00:13:49.029
So,
00:13:49.029 - 00:13:49.779
you know,
00:13:49.779 - 00:13:51.919
you just kind of...
00:13:51.919 - 00:13:56.099
I have one and even like early two-year-old and yearling,
00:13:56.100 - 00:13:57.940
he just kind of hanged back from his company.
00:13:57.940 - 00:14:00.900
And you could tell he just wasn't figuring it out.
00:14:00.899 - 00:14:02.970
So we were getting a little frustrated.
00:14:02.970 - 00:14:05.139
And we're in his three-year-old year in the spring.
00:14:05.139 - 00:14:05.819
And I said,
00:14:05.819 - 00:14:06.229
well,
00:14:06.230 - 00:14:06.800
you know,
00:14:06.799 - 00:14:08.299
let's just try...
00:14:08.299 - 00:14:12.809
let's run him at a smaller track before we put him in for a claiming tag.
00:14:12.809 - 00:14:16.849
And let's see if once he gets some confidence,
00:14:16.850 - 00:14:20.170
if he'll take that and it translates forward.
00:14:20.170 - 00:14:20.870
So we did.
00:14:20.870 - 00:14:22.279
We ran him at Indiana.
00:14:22.279 - 00:14:22.980
He won.
00:14:22.980 - 00:14:26.200
Then he came back and won an allowance race at Churchill.
00:14:26.200 - 00:14:28.820
Then he ran second in a stakes race at Saratoga.
00:14:28.819 - 00:14:31.609
Then he ran a really nice race in the Pennsylvania Derby.
00:14:31.610 - 00:14:32.930
And all he had to do...
00:14:32.930 - 00:14:36.170
and he had five races prior to that where he just had no effort,
00:14:36.170 - 00:14:36.779
you know.
00:14:36.779 - 00:14:38.259
So we try to find places.
00:14:38.259 - 00:14:42.710
Let's try to find a place and let this horse win and see if he gets his confidence up.
00:14:42.710 - 00:14:43.090
Colts,
00:14:43.089 - 00:14:43.709
you know,
00:14:43.710 - 00:14:47.140
there's always the ultimate equipment change.
00:14:47.139 - 00:14:47.519
So,
00:14:47.519 - 00:14:48.539
you know,
00:14:48.539 - 00:14:50.259
and then some of them,
00:14:50.259 - 00:14:54.480
we really have to see if there's something wrong with them,
00:14:54.480 - 00:14:57.910
because they'll subclinically have something wrong.
00:14:57.910 - 00:14:59.259
And we'll try to,
00:14:59.259 - 00:14:59.860
you know,
00:14:59.860 - 00:15:00.649
try to see.
00:15:00.649 - 00:15:01.410
You know,
00:15:01.410 - 00:15:01.670
Dr.
00:15:01.670 - 00:15:04.180
Bramlich has a van of mine every week.
00:15:04.180 - 00:15:06.750
So,
00:15:06.750 - 00:15:08.019
you know,
00:15:08.019 - 00:15:09.200
it's a big...
00:15:09.200 - 00:15:11.450
you're trying to figure this puzzle out.
00:15:11.450 - 00:15:11.730
So,
00:15:11.730 - 00:15:12.480
you know,
00:15:12.480 - 00:15:13.170
equipment,
00:15:13.170 - 00:15:15.460
maybe if I don't breeze them as often,
00:15:15.460 - 00:15:16.700
maybe they'll stay more competitive,
00:15:16.700 - 00:15:17.070
you know.
00:15:17.069 - 00:15:18.149
And you're looking at the horse.
00:15:18.149 - 00:15:20.319
If the horse doesn't look fresh and he looks tired,
00:15:20.319 - 00:15:20.629
then,
00:15:20.629 - 00:15:21.089
you know,
00:15:21.089 - 00:15:23.519
maybe he just needs a break and regroup and come on.
00:15:23.519 - 00:15:23.839
And,
00:15:23.839 - 00:15:24.369
you know,
00:15:24.370 - 00:15:27.700
just try to see it with another set of eyes in a couple months.
00:15:27.700 - 00:15:29.890
It's really interesting about the running at the different tracks,
00:15:29.889 - 00:15:32.350
and all of a sudden it changes trajectory of that horse.
00:15:32.350 - 00:15:35.389
Do you see any social interactions in the barn between the horses?
00:15:35.389 - 00:15:38.180
Like some of them do better in association with other horses,
00:15:38.180 - 00:15:40.340
or do they just sort of keep themselves?
00:15:40.339 - 00:15:40.869
Well,
00:15:40.870 - 00:15:44.660
some of them in the barn are more social than others.
00:15:44.660 - 00:15:45.420
You know,
00:15:45.420 - 00:15:46.660
they'll come out.
00:15:46.660 - 00:15:48.150
You have a horse that comes out.
00:15:48.149 - 00:15:50.029
Some of them do not want to be messed with.
00:15:50.029 - 00:15:51.049
And you get,
00:15:51.049 - 00:15:51.220
like,
00:15:51.220 - 00:15:54.379
the barn ponies are notorious for getting other horses in trouble,
00:15:54.379 - 00:15:55.789
because they'll go eat their hay net,
00:15:55.789 - 00:15:56.949
and they're attacking them,
00:15:56.950 - 00:15:59.100
and somebody ends up with the leg over the webbing,
00:15:59.100 - 00:16:01.379
or a rider ends up tossed off the pony.
00:16:01.379 - 00:16:01.670
So,
00:16:01.670 - 00:16:02.290
you know,
00:16:02.289 - 00:16:03.339
they do have it.
00:16:03.339 - 00:16:03.659
And,
00:16:03.660 - 00:16:04.320
you know,
00:16:04.319 - 00:16:05.539
even in...
00:16:05.539 - 00:16:07.629
We breeze most of our horses in company,
00:16:07.629 - 00:16:08.660
so you can kind of see,
00:16:08.660 - 00:16:09.150
you know,
00:16:09.149 - 00:16:09.579
like,
00:16:09.579 - 00:16:11.549
this one does not want any part of that one.
00:16:11.549 - 00:16:13.029
Or when they're out there on the track,
00:16:13.029 - 00:16:14.899
and they're trying to kick the other horses,
00:16:14.899 - 00:16:15.789
you know,
00:16:15.789 - 00:16:21.139
so there is definitely that aspect to their personalities.
00:16:21.139 - 00:16:21.299
Yeah,
00:16:21.299 - 00:16:22.099
it's like me and Bart,
00:16:22.100 - 00:16:22.389
really.
00:16:22.389 - 00:16:26.180
I can't keep Peter out of my hay net.
00:16:26.180 - 00:16:26.410
Yeah,
00:16:26.410 - 00:16:26.900
there you go,
00:16:26.899 - 00:16:27.509
that's exactly...
00:16:27.509 - 00:16:27.620
Well,
00:16:27.620 - 00:16:30.009
your hay's always better than mine.
00:16:30.009 - 00:16:30.309
So,
00:16:30.309 - 00:16:33.939
you mentioned about finding issues with the horses,
00:16:33.940 - 00:16:38.019
and so what are the things that you find holds these horses back from,
00:16:38.019 - 00:16:38.259
like,
00:16:38.259 - 00:16:39.059
a medical or,
00:16:39.059 - 00:16:39.429
like,
00:16:39.430 - 00:16:40.810
a lameness standpoint?
00:16:40.809 - 00:16:45.509
And what impact do you think that some of the wearable technology is going to have on these horses,
00:16:45.509 - 00:16:47.700
and your ability to bring the best of them out?
00:16:47.700 - 00:16:54.500
I will just say I have not educated myself fully on the wearable technology.
00:16:54.500 - 00:17:00.339
I think a lot of what we do,
00:17:00.339 - 00:17:01.720
if you pay attention,
00:17:01.720 - 00:17:04.180
the wearable technology is going to tell you.
00:17:04.180 - 00:17:09.380
And sometimes the wearable technology will make you see something you're avoiding seeing,
00:17:09.380 - 00:17:10.030
you know,
00:17:10.029 - 00:17:12.829
like we use the Slep app a lot for things.
00:17:12.829 - 00:17:14.420
And normally on that,
00:17:14.420 - 00:17:17.180
we're pretty on point to what we're seeing on the horse.
00:17:17.180 - 00:17:17.970
But obviously,
00:17:17.970 - 00:17:19.460
when they're at full speed,
00:17:19.460 - 00:17:20.910
that's a different story.
00:17:20.910 - 00:17:21.190
So,
00:17:21.190 - 00:17:21.829
you know,
00:17:21.829 - 00:17:24.409
I just think what the technology is doing,
00:17:24.410 - 00:17:27.660
is doing a very good job at stopping earlier,
00:17:27.660 - 00:17:31.059
before the horse becomes really clinical,
00:17:31.059 - 00:17:32.420
and really,
00:17:32.420 - 00:17:33.220
really lame,
00:17:33.220 - 00:17:35.880
to the point to where they're just beaten down,
00:17:35.880 - 00:17:37.780
or the body can't recover from it.
00:17:39.700 - 00:17:42.860
I think with the way the rules are now,
00:17:42.860 - 00:17:44.019
we're also,
00:17:44.019 - 00:17:48.950
that's also forcing people to stop on the horses before,
00:17:48.950 - 00:17:50.460
because you can't inject horses,
00:17:50.460 - 00:17:52.820
and you can't inject your way out of a problem,
00:17:52.819 - 00:17:55.629
you can't inject them and put them in a claiming race,
00:17:55.630 - 00:17:57.450
which that was status quo before,
00:17:57.450 - 00:17:59.490
and that's just not now.
00:17:59.490 - 00:18:00.549
And we are,
00:18:00.549 - 00:18:01.819
as a trainer,
00:18:01.819 - 00:18:04.170
we're better educated.
00:18:04.170 - 00:18:09.910
And we owe it to the sport to make sure that we're being responsible.
00:18:09.910 - 00:18:12.340
And I think that there's a big,
00:18:12.339 - 00:18:17.859
there's becoming this big cavern between some trainers that are going with it,
00:18:17.860 - 00:18:20.820
and some that are kind of stagnant and don't,
00:18:20.819 - 00:18:24.179
really aren't pushing their way over to this way,
00:18:24.180 - 00:18:26.900
because we're not going back this way,
00:18:26.900 - 00:18:27.580
that's it,
00:18:27.579 - 00:18:28.470
that's over.
00:18:28.470 - 00:18:29.630
And that's not okay,
00:18:29.630 - 00:18:30.269
you know,
00:18:30.269 - 00:18:33.309
to just sit there and let a horse that's not moving great.
00:18:33.309 - 00:18:34.750
And it used to be racing sound,
00:18:34.750 - 00:18:36.349
it's not racing sound anymore,
00:18:36.349 - 00:18:37.699
these horses have to be sound.
00:18:37.700 - 00:18:38.029
So,
00:18:38.029 - 00:18:38.730
you know,
00:18:38.730 - 00:18:39.990
there's a lot of,
00:18:39.990 - 00:18:41.960
there's a lot of change in that.
00:18:41.960 - 00:18:42.900
And I do think,
00:18:42.900 - 00:18:43.390
you know,
00:18:43.389 - 00:18:44.699
with the wearable technology,
00:18:44.700 - 00:18:45.349
a lot of times,
00:18:45.349 - 00:18:47.460
you have to disseminate the information too,
00:18:47.460 - 00:18:49.730
and know what to do with it.
00:18:49.730 - 00:18:50.110
So,
00:18:50.110 - 00:18:51.820
as with everything,
00:18:51.820 - 00:18:53.380
it has its place.
00:18:53.380 - 00:18:58.500
But I also think that it will help those who are kind of over here,
00:18:58.500 - 00:18:59.700
come over here.
00:18:59.700 - 00:19:00.119
Yeah,
00:19:00.119 - 00:19:03.210
and I think that's important for the public to realise,
00:19:03.210 - 00:19:04.700
in that technology,
00:19:04.700 - 00:19:07.539
and the information that we're getting from that,
00:19:07.539 - 00:19:09.460
is actually improving the game.
00:19:09.460 - 00:19:12.139
And people should take heart from the fact that,
00:19:12.139 - 00:19:12.419
obviously,
00:19:12.420 - 00:19:16.480
the welfare of the horse is much more important than people realise,
00:19:16.480 - 00:19:17.039
in that,
00:19:17.039 - 00:19:17.779
you know,
00:19:17.779 - 00:19:19.980
you're in the business because you love horses,
00:19:19.980 - 00:19:20.460
right?
00:19:20.460 - 00:19:22.579
And so you want the best for your horses.
00:19:22.579 - 00:19:24.389
And everything you've said today,
00:19:24.389 - 00:19:25.679
the underlying thing is,
00:19:25.679 - 00:19:27.779
is that I want the best for this horse.
00:19:27.779 - 00:19:29.630
Whatever this horse is going to become,
00:19:29.630 - 00:19:32.019
I want it to become the absolute best it can be.
00:19:32.019 - 00:19:34.559
And if one horse stands out and is really elite,
00:19:34.559 - 00:19:36.990
and you've had some phenomenal success,
00:19:36.990 - 00:19:37.940
that's great.
00:19:37.940 - 00:19:44.340
But that is only built upon making every horse that's ever been in your care for training the best it can be.
00:19:44.340 - 00:19:45.690
And that's how you sharpen things up.
00:19:45.690 - 00:19:47.539
And it sort of comes down to the art of the science,
00:19:47.539 - 00:19:47.779
right?
00:19:47.779 - 00:19:49.730
There's a lot of science involved in training.
00:19:49.730 - 00:19:50.820
But there's also an art,
00:19:50.820 - 00:19:52.100
and there's a lot of nuances.
00:19:52.099 - 00:19:58.179
And that's what makes one horse go from good to great.
00:19:58.179 - 00:20:02.029
I have thought about this a lot in the last couple years,
00:20:02.029 - 00:20:07.299
because there is a lot of friction within our sport,
00:20:07.299 - 00:20:10.480
with the new and the old.
00:20:10.480 - 00:20:12.789
And I kind of laugh,
00:20:12.789 - 00:20:14.490
because when I was younger,
00:20:14.490 - 00:20:17.429
I had to read the book "Who Moved My Cheese?" and,
00:20:17.429 - 00:20:18.069
you know,
00:20:18.070 - 00:20:21.059
which mouse survived and which mouse didn't.
00:20:21.059 - 00:20:21.789
But,
00:20:21.789 - 00:20:23.309
you know,
00:20:23.309 - 00:20:27.470
I think as our sport is more mainstream,
00:20:27.470 - 00:20:30.110
and we have social media,
00:20:30.110 - 00:20:34.000
and we have accessible phones,
00:20:34.000 - 00:20:36.360
where nothing is hidden,
00:20:36.360 - 00:20:39.250
as much as some allude to it.
00:20:39.250 - 00:20:41.059
But if you can't,
00:20:41.059 - 00:20:42.179
you know,
00:20:42.179 - 00:20:42.500
again,
00:20:42.500 - 00:20:44.779
I'm going to go back to I was a science major,
00:20:44.779 - 00:20:45.460
pre-med.
00:20:45.460 - 00:20:46.740
So a lot of what we do,
00:20:46.740 - 00:20:49.750
I can just tool my thinking into.
00:20:49.750 - 00:20:50.470
It's the same,
00:20:50.470 - 00:20:51.210
basically.
00:20:51.210 - 00:20:52.529
But if you have a PET scan,
00:20:52.529 - 00:20:56.240
and it says this horse is like at high risk for breakdown,
00:20:56.240 - 00:20:57.360
you have your answer.
00:20:57.360 - 00:20:58.090
But somebody,
00:20:58.090 - 00:20:58.809
at some point,
00:20:58.809 - 00:21:00.829
probably had to tell you to do...
00:21:00.829 - 00:21:01.769
not all the time,
00:21:01.769 - 00:21:03.019
but sometimes it's,
00:21:03.019 - 00:21:03.230
yeah,
00:21:03.230 - 00:21:05.769
we're not going to let you run until you do this.
00:21:05.769 - 00:21:07.920
And then the answer is right there for you.
00:21:07.920 - 00:21:10.260
And somebody has had to advocate for the horse.
00:21:10.259 - 00:21:12.820
And there's a lot more of that as well going on.
00:21:12.820 - 00:21:13.210
Yeah,
00:21:13.210 - 00:21:14.900
I think you're right with all of that,
00:21:14.900 - 00:21:17.650
because we have to get under the same umbrella.
00:21:17.650 - 00:21:21.210
And you talked about the cavern and the divide between people.
00:21:21.210 - 00:21:23.440
But to keep the sport popular and mainstream,
00:21:23.440 - 00:21:26.519
we all got to get on the same page and row together.
00:21:26.519 - 00:21:29.570
We're going to lose some momentum and lose popularity,
00:21:29.570 - 00:21:30.610
as we've seen.
00:21:30.610 - 00:21:31.380
Well,
00:21:31.380 - 00:21:32.019
and again,
00:21:32.019 - 00:21:32.720
you know,
00:21:32.720 - 00:21:33.450
it's hard.
00:21:33.450 - 00:21:34.559
Nobody...
00:21:34.559 - 00:21:38.420
there's always a big resistance to change in any aspect in life.
00:21:38.980 - 00:21:40.340
And this is no different.
00:21:40.340 - 00:21:41.300
You know,
00:21:41.299 - 00:21:43.000
and it's...
00:21:43.000 - 00:21:44.259
we all know,
00:21:44.259 - 00:21:45.329
knock on wood,
00:21:45.329 - 00:21:46.579
bad things happen.
00:21:46.579 - 00:21:47.549
You know,
00:21:47.549 - 00:21:50.170
it's a statistical machine.
00:21:50.170 - 00:21:54.180
But the more you can keep tweaking that down,
00:21:54.179 - 00:21:55.789
the better it is for everybody.
00:21:55.789 - 00:21:56.720
And ultimately,
00:21:56.720 - 00:21:58.099
the horse is in our sport.
00:21:58.099 - 00:21:58.419
Yeah.
00:21:58.420 - 00:22:00.580
And we've learned a lot in the last few years.
00:22:00.579 - 00:22:04.259
And we do owe it to the horse to continue to improve that as well.
00:22:04.259 - 00:22:04.750
Right.
00:22:04.750 - 00:22:05.700
Most definitely.
00:22:05.700 - 00:22:05.960
Yeah.
00:22:05.960 - 00:22:07.220
And everybody's on the same page.
00:22:07.220 - 00:22:08.639
You want the best thing for the horse.
00:22:08.639 - 00:22:12.960
And if people derive income and pleasure from the horse fulfilling its athletic potential,
00:22:12.960 - 00:22:13.909
everybody wins,
00:22:13.909 - 00:22:14.259
right?
00:22:14.259 - 00:22:15.340
The horse has a job.
00:22:15.340 - 00:22:15.830
And again,
00:22:15.829 - 00:22:20.139
it provides employment for people and it makes the place colourful.
00:22:20.139 - 00:22:20.980
Absolutely.
00:22:20.980 - 00:22:21.500
Well,
00:22:21.500 - 00:22:22.659
and I think some...
00:22:22.659 - 00:22:25.059
I have a pony that I just retired.
00:22:25.059 - 00:22:26.200
He's 20 years old.
00:22:26.200 - 00:22:27.099
And his purpose,
00:22:27.099 - 00:22:28.589
he loved to be in the barn.
00:22:28.590 - 00:22:30.690
And I know his days are numbered now,
00:22:30.690 - 00:22:32.139
because he doesn't...
00:22:32.139 - 00:22:33.440
he likes to be in the barn.
00:22:33.440 - 00:22:35.460
He likes to be part of the action.
00:22:35.460 - 00:22:37.049
And these are the same for these horses.
00:22:37.049 - 00:22:38.639
They like the job that they're given.
00:22:38.639 - 00:22:39.859
They like having a duty.
00:22:39.860 - 00:22:40.519
A lot of them,
00:22:40.519 - 00:22:42.679
when you turn them out for a second career,
00:22:42.679 - 00:22:43.940
don't really do well.
00:22:43.940 - 00:22:45.869
They want to please.
00:22:45.869 - 00:22:48.329
They want something to do.
00:22:48.329 - 00:22:48.980
And,
00:22:48.980 - 00:22:49.759
you know,
00:22:49.759 - 00:22:50.480
again,
00:22:50.480 - 00:22:52.659
that's one thing that,
00:22:52.659 - 00:22:55.099
as long as we can continue to do this,
00:22:55.099 - 00:22:57.329
and we can continue to evolve,
00:22:57.329 - 00:23:00.500
our sport should be around for a very long time.
00:23:00.500 - 00:23:01.289
But again,
00:23:01.289 - 00:23:02.240
some of this,
00:23:02.240 - 00:23:07.220
the rules have to overcompensate for those who kind of are resistant to,
00:23:07.220 - 00:23:07.500
or,
00:23:07.500 - 00:23:08.139
you know,
00:23:08.139 - 00:23:09.389
turning a blind eye,
00:23:09.389 - 00:23:11.859
or just not wanting to be realistic about,
00:23:11.860 - 00:23:12.350
you know,
00:23:12.349 - 00:23:13.299
certain situations.
00:23:13.299 - 00:23:13.659
Yeah.
00:23:13.659 - 00:23:16.109
And horses are built the way they're built to run,
00:23:16.110 - 00:23:17.230
because they like to run.
00:23:17.230 - 00:23:19.369
And I don't see healthy horses all the time,
00:23:19.369 - 00:23:21.389
but sometimes you go out and you drive to a farm,
00:23:21.389 - 00:23:21.759
right,
00:23:21.759 - 00:23:22.389
and you stop,
00:23:22.389 - 00:23:24.899
and you watch the mares and the foals in the paddock.
00:23:24.900 - 00:23:25.990
And it's sort of like the mares,
00:23:25.990 - 00:23:27.139
they back them up against one end,
00:23:27.139 - 00:23:28.579
and they run to the other end.
00:23:28.579 - 00:23:28.869
I mean,
00:23:28.869 - 00:23:30.149
these foals were just loving to run,
00:23:30.150 - 00:23:30.430
right?
00:23:30.429 - 00:23:31.190
They had these legs.
00:23:31.190 - 00:23:31.619
Well,
00:23:31.619 - 00:23:32.259
let's use them,
00:23:32.259 - 00:23:32.579
right?
00:23:32.579 - 00:23:33.069
Right.
00:23:33.070 - 00:23:33.370
Yeah.
00:23:33.369 - 00:23:34.500
And we were sort of thinking,
00:23:34.500 - 00:23:34.630
oh,
00:23:34.630 - 00:23:36.100
we're making this horse do this thing.
00:23:36.099 - 00:23:36.579
Well,
00:23:36.579 - 00:23:37.710
it evolved to run.
00:23:37.710 - 00:23:38.840
When you look at it,
00:23:38.840 - 00:23:40.900
it is absolutely built for speed.
00:23:40.900 - 00:23:44.330
So why shouldn't everybody sort of get on board with that,
00:23:44.329 - 00:23:46.419
and allow the horse to do what it was designed to do?
00:23:46.420 - 00:23:49.940
And so moving to it in a different direction,
00:23:49.940 - 00:23:50.659
how do you,
00:23:50.659 - 00:23:54.639
what would you suggest people who want to get into the racing world,
00:23:54.639 - 00:23:55.259
and,
00:23:55.259 - 00:23:55.820
you know,
00:23:55.820 - 00:23:58.340
look up to you and want to get where you're at?
00:23:58.340 - 00:23:59.539
How do they get there?
00:23:59.539 - 00:24:00.679
You know,
00:24:00.679 - 00:24:06.919
we were talking prior to this that I have a unique personality,
00:24:06.920 - 00:24:09.910
and I don't want to say everybody has the same personality,
00:24:09.909 - 00:24:11.539
but you have to work really hard.
00:24:11.539 - 00:24:14.889
And I've been told no many times,
00:24:14.889 - 00:24:16.339
and I just kind of like,
00:24:16.340 - 00:24:16.769
okay,
00:24:16.769 - 00:24:19.139
and I like constructive criticism,
00:24:19.139 - 00:24:19.779
so okay,
00:24:19.779 - 00:24:21.059
I'm no right now,
00:24:21.059 - 00:24:23.299
but I'll be yes at some point.
00:24:23.299 - 00:24:26.500
And you just have to really work hard,
00:24:27.539 - 00:24:28.509
be open to constructive,
00:24:28.509 - 00:24:30.079
and you have to have really thick skin,
00:24:30.079 - 00:24:32.129
and I think that's in any aspect of life.
00:24:32.130 - 00:24:32.960
I can never,
00:24:32.960 - 00:24:35.400
I've never felt like I was the victim,
00:24:35.400 - 00:24:36.180
you know,
00:24:36.179 - 00:24:39.859
and I think that that's just a way in general,
00:24:39.860 - 00:24:42.220
but to succeed in life.
00:24:42.220 - 00:24:42.779
But,
00:24:42.779 - 00:24:43.789
you know,
00:24:43.789 - 00:24:44.960
as far as,
00:24:44.960 - 00:24:46.909
we have a niche sport,
00:24:46.909 - 00:24:51.899
and there are more opportunities through internships,
00:24:51.900 - 00:24:52.300
or,
00:24:52.299 - 00:24:53.220
you know,
00:24:53.220 - 00:24:54.019
you go,
00:24:54.019 - 00:24:56.250
you can reach out to trainers,
00:24:56.250 - 00:24:58.220
you can reach out to farms,
00:24:58.220 - 00:24:59.299
just via email.
00:24:59.299 - 00:24:59.840
And just,
00:24:59.840 - 00:25:02.330
you gotta put yourself out there,
00:25:02.329 - 00:25:03.029
and just ask,
00:25:03.029 - 00:25:03.279
and,
00:25:03.279 - 00:25:03.779
you know,
00:25:03.779 - 00:25:05.179
understand people are busy,
00:25:05.179 - 00:25:07.199
so it just might take them a little while.
00:25:07.200 - 00:25:07.440
Yeah,
00:25:07.440 - 00:25:08.349
but that being said,
00:25:08.349 - 00:25:09.969
what I've seen in the horse industry,
00:25:09.970 - 00:25:11.639
is people do love to teach.
00:25:11.639 - 00:25:12.549
Oh yeah.
00:25:12.549 - 00:25:16.740
And if you've shown that you are somebody who's curious,
00:25:16.740 - 00:25:17.860
and who will work hard,
00:25:17.860 - 00:25:18.809
you can get a long ways,
00:25:18.809 - 00:25:21.029
and people will share their knowledge with you.
00:25:21.029 - 00:25:21.779
Exactly,
00:25:21.779 - 00:25:24.000
and I have some young employees,
00:25:24.000 - 00:25:24.740
you know,
00:25:24.740 - 00:25:26.799
one is a 17 year old girl,
00:25:26.799 - 00:25:29.059
who's friends with my stepdaughter,
00:25:29.059 - 00:25:30.420
and we're friends with her family,
00:25:30.420 - 00:25:30.840
you know,
00:25:30.840 - 00:25:31.559
family friends,
00:25:31.559 - 00:25:32.549
and she wants to learn.
00:25:32.549 - 00:25:33.170
And I said,
00:25:33.170 - 00:25:35.680
I don't have the time to sit and teach you,
00:25:35.679 - 00:25:37.009
but if you're like me,
00:25:37.009 - 00:25:37.990
you'll learn.
00:25:37.990 - 00:25:39.059
Just walk around,
00:25:39.059 - 00:25:39.759
when the vet's there,
00:25:39.759 - 00:25:40.400
just walk around.
00:25:40.400 - 00:25:41.019
That's what I did.
00:25:41.019 - 00:25:42.059
I would just walk around,
00:25:42.059 - 00:25:42.820
ask questions.
00:25:42.820 - 00:25:45.980
When I was early on as an assistant trainer,
00:25:45.980 - 00:25:46.500
I said,
00:25:46.500 - 00:25:48.259
what do I need to know?
00:25:48.259 - 00:25:49.009
And,
00:25:49.009 - 00:25:49.700
you know,
00:25:49.700 - 00:25:51.079
this one vet took me,
00:25:51.079 - 00:25:52.399
taught me anatomy,
00:25:52.400 - 00:25:53.559
how things work,
00:25:53.559 - 00:25:55.139
how the throat works,
00:25:55.139 - 00:25:56.179
what's important,
00:25:56.179 - 00:25:56.669
what's,
00:25:56.670 - 00:25:57.130
you know,
00:25:57.130 - 00:25:57.600
you know,
00:25:57.599 - 00:25:58.899
what can you get away with?
00:25:58.900 - 00:26:01.309
So you just have to really put yourself out there.
00:26:01.309 - 00:26:02.389
And it's almost like,
00:26:02.389 - 00:26:02.629
yeah,
00:26:02.630 - 00:26:04.000
you just have to be a sponge,
00:26:04.000 - 00:26:04.539
like I said,
00:26:04.539 - 00:26:06.829
and you have to take it upon yourself.
00:26:06.829 - 00:26:07.629
You can't,
00:26:07.630 - 00:26:08.430
you know,
00:26:08.429 - 00:26:09.149
I get busy,
00:26:09.150 - 00:26:10.870
and I have other things,
00:26:10.869 - 00:26:12.929
but my assistants and my foremen,
00:26:12.929 - 00:26:14.359
they want help all they can.
00:26:14.360 - 00:26:16.670
So if they can teach you how to do wound care,
00:26:16.670 - 00:26:17.430
they'll teach you,
00:26:17.429 - 00:26:20.109
because that means it's one less thing to take off their plate.
00:26:20.110 - 00:26:20.300
Yeah,
00:26:20.299 - 00:26:21.059
and I think that's right,
00:26:21.059 - 00:26:22.759
that that's what I found at every level,
00:26:22.759 - 00:26:26.670
and everybody in the horse industry has always been really generous with their advice,
00:26:26.670 - 00:26:28.240
because we're all on the same team,
00:26:28.240 - 00:26:28.610
right?
00:26:28.610 - 00:26:29.220
We're on the team,
00:26:29.220 - 00:26:29.809
team horse,
00:26:29.809 - 00:26:30.240
right?
00:26:30.240 - 00:26:32.190
And everybody just feeds off each other,
00:26:32.190 - 00:26:32.900
and that way,
00:26:32.900 - 00:26:33.539
and we all get better.
00:26:33.539 - 00:26:35.090
And that's been the great thing about it,
00:26:35.090 - 00:26:37.220
is that I've really enjoyed my interactions with you.
00:26:37.220 - 00:26:37.869
And again,
00:26:37.869 - 00:26:41.059
I'm really grateful that you came into the podcast today,
00:26:41.059 - 00:26:42.259
and talking about you,
00:26:42.259 - 00:26:42.820
and what,
00:26:42.820 - 00:26:43.309
what you,
00:26:43.309 - 00:26:44.500
what you see in the horse.
00:26:44.500 - 00:26:44.809
Well,
00:26:44.809 - 00:26:45.360
thanks.
00:26:45.360 - 00:26:45.780
And then,
00:26:45.779 - 00:26:47.070
it's because I call,
00:26:47.070 - 00:26:47.950
I call Dr.
00:26:47.950 - 00:26:48.960
Morrissey all the time.
00:26:48.960 - 00:26:50.009
I have this weird thing,
00:26:50.009 - 00:26:50.409
or it's,
00:26:50.409 - 00:26:51.440
can you come out here?
00:26:51.440 - 00:26:52.500
And sometimes he can,
00:26:52.500 - 00:26:54.099
and sometimes he can't,
00:26:54.099 - 00:26:54.480
so.
00:26:54.480 - 00:26:55.320
But for you,
00:26:55.320 - 00:26:57.539
I'll always make an exception.
00:26:57.539 - 00:26:59.670
This has been an illuminating conversation.
00:26:59.670 - 00:27:02.980
I'm sure there's going to be a lot of the viewership of our podcast,
00:27:02.980 - 00:27:04.380
that'll have a ton of questions,
00:27:04.380 - 00:27:06.500
subsequent to what you've been talking about.
00:27:06.500 - 00:27:06.660
Yeah,
00:27:06.660 - 00:27:08.569
thank you very much for being with us today.
00:27:08.569 - 00:27:08.890
It's,
00:27:08.890 - 00:27:10.150
and like I told you earlier,
00:27:10.150 - 00:27:11.220
it was easy to cheer for you.
00:27:11.220 - 00:27:13.609
It was so fun to watch the Triple Crown races,
00:27:13.609 - 00:27:15.619
and cheer for you in Golden Tempo.
00:27:15.619 - 00:27:16.339
And it's,
00:27:16.339 - 00:27:19.180
it's brought a lot of great publicity to the sport,
00:27:19.180 - 00:27:20.180
and thank you.
00:27:20.180 - 00:27:20.369
Yeah,
00:27:20.369 - 00:27:20.980
it really has.
00:27:20.980 - 00:27:21.859
And again,
00:27:21.859 - 00:27:23.430
thank you for being on the podcast,
00:27:23.430 - 00:27:24.809
and just thanks for being you.
00:27:24.809 - 00:27:25.140
As I say,
00:27:25.140 - 00:27:26.799
I've really enjoyed our interactions.
00:27:26.799 - 00:27:27.130
Well,
00:27:27.130 - 00:27:28.299
thank you for having me on.
00:27:28.299 - 00:27:28.900
It was fun.
00:27:28.900 - 00:27:29.299
Yep,
00:27:29.299 - 00:27:29.619
great.
00:27:29.619 - 00:27:31.509
And that was our stall side for this week.
00:27:31.509 - 00:27:33.359
We've been talking to Cherie Deveaux.
00:27:33.359 - 00:27:35.569
She's had some great success training horses,
00:27:35.569 - 00:27:39.769
and she's got some great insights on how to get a horse to fulfill its this potential.
00:27:39.769 - 00:27:40.440
See you next time.